http://www.amazon.com/Moshpit-Culture-Joe-Ambrose/dp/0711987440(ITP V.012 EDITORS NOTE: The above book was an interesting read):
ITP V.012 EDITORIAL: I am absolutely resenting any negative stereotypes, generalizations and stigmas regarding METAL, music and moshing, when perhaps the people speaking know nothing about underground music, are "soccer moms", or are complete waste cases, uncultured whom have never been in a pit.
Since, 2009, ITP has dedicated an entire monthly series to (THE ART OF DANCE) and regarding every aspect of mosh pit/underground dance culture, nearly running out of ideas, including:
http://spak-individualthoughtpatterns.blogspot.com/2012/01/itp-v012-art-of-dance-part-one-mosh.html
..And while I tried to keep the reality of mosh pit failures, humorous, mosh pit failures, either fan or band provoked CAN, and sometimes does go TRAGICALLY wrong.
Whatever someones's opinion of this tragic incident at the 2010 LAMB OF GOD show, keep in mind it is irrelevant if you like the band or not, and he is not (RANDY BLYTHE) above the law with semi celebrity status. Do not express your opinion to me (ITP's author) specificallly if I don't know you, as I will lock your ass up, or you'll be pushing daises as misguided as that self rightous bullshit is.
Crowd management control issues can happen anywhere to everywhere to anyone, from Black Friday and soccer match crowd surges and riots, to rock concert fatalities.
#stayoffthestage
ITP's V.012 author is 42 (no joke, really, I may look young, but I'm older and wiser), and over the last 30 some odd years, with plenty of concert, booking, multi-media and mosh pit experience, I have heard of quite a few fan tragedies at both music and sporting events. If you run on the field during a baseball game, you might just get tackled, tasered and arrested. If you jump on stage during a bands show,specifically without being invited, you might be pushed off stage by band and/or venue security. While a collective "booo" can be heard from fans regarding overzealous venue security, the middle ground is situating venue security between the stage and the fans, with security behind a barricade (inbetween the stage and fans) pushing back and catching crowd-surfers. No one can stage dive if security prevents them from being onstage and it's better to push the crowdsurfers backwards as thier momentum is being carried forward. Some crowdsurfers would even appreciate the human barricade, avoiding that silly dilemma of either the temptation or need to stagedive instead of falling over that barricade. Venue security should also be in the mosh pit, and acclimated to mosh pit culture.
I don't mean to "glamorize" moshing as sometimes kids come to shows with no concert moshing experience, as the road is only paved with good intentions and people really do get hurt. I've watched videos of shows and festivals I've attended on YOU TUBE, and while the videos were somewhat edited, I remember, as a spectator what I went through at those shows both good and bad, it looks better on video, the physicality of being there, specifically in the mosh pit, is a totally different story. The bruises, soreness, sprains and the absolute adrenaline rush and euphoria of the intensity of the music, bands performance and the fans antics in the mosh pit is something that can told only by fans, it's looks and feels way different being at a show rather than still pics or/and videos.
When the unthinkable happened to DAMAGEPLAN's (former PANTERA) jovial guitarist DARRELL ABBOTT, the metal and music community started to revamp concert policy and security, somewhat belated post 9/11.
ITP's V.012 author's own personal experiences, stalkers, wingnuts following this journal, drug addicts bullying those of us whom are sober, process servers. I have protected myself, and I'm not sorry if I ever did. Here in the USA, 60% of America have "Stand Your Ground" or "Castle Statute" legislations, you trespass, you're fair game, you LOSE, line drawn in the sand.
FROM JACK GIBSON: EXODUS: "I'm very surprised that that happened. I mean, we've had very [much] the same type of thing happen. We had a guy get on stage and was singing with Rob [Dukes, EXODUS vocalist] arm-in-arm, and when Rob pulled the mic away, the guy didn't wanna go and he grabbed Rob's arm and twisted him and Rob beat the fucking shit out of him on stage for it and [rightfully] so. And I got in there and wanted to give him the boot. That's our stage when we're there, you know what I mean?! That's our shit up there — that's our stuff, our pedals, our guitars… That's our place. Everybody knows what happened to Dimebag [late PANTERA/DAMAGEPLAN guitarist "Dimebag" Darrell Abbott who was shot and killed onstage while performing with DAMAGEPLAN in December 2004] — this guy just walks onstage and he's out of his fucking mind and shit goes incredibly wrong. There's a lot of bands that, after that happened, they just said, 'No people on stage, period.' For us, it's kind of part of our shows — letting people get up and jump off and all that stuff. We kind of have this… It's kind of a collective idea of who's been on stage too long. Like, you just know when a guy is not wanting to… You know, you get up, you can headbang, you can even come over and give us [a quick pat on the back], and run, and then you've gotta go — you've gotta go. I don't know, man. That's a little bit disturbing. Of course, I have sympathy for the kid who died and that he was in a coma, all that. Of course, I don't like to see anybody die or say that anybody deserved anything or whatever, but I am very surprised that that happened. And I can't imagine that a good lawyer isn't gonna get this settled, because it's like, if you come on stage, you're trespassing, you know what I mean?! It's almost like we just have to wait and see how this shakes out. I super-hope it [sorts itself out], 'cause that's a pretty serious situation, so I hope for [Randy] it's alright."
FROM DAVID DRAIMAN (DISTURBED):
"[Randy] didnt 'slaughter' anyone. The kid jumped on stage and started a brawl, and Randy defended himself. That his life was lost in the process is truly unfortunate, but Randy is my friend and he's no murderer. I feel for the child and for the family and for Randy, but you have to understand that ever since Dimebag Darrell [late PANTERA/DAMAGEPLAN guitarist] was assaulted, shot, and murdered on stage by a 'fan,' all of us have been very defensive/cautious of anyone jumping up on stage. I'm not saying that it's OK, or justified, or anything like that, only that it's an unfortunate/tragic set of circumstances, and that I know Randy's intention was not to kill the kid. That's my opinion. I've heard yours. That is all."
FROM SCOTT IAN (ANTHRAX):
"[It's] complete and utter bullshit for [Randy] to be treated like a criminal for something he didn't do. Now fans can see first-hand why there's no stagediving anymore. Especially in the post-Darrell world we live in. [Referring to late PANTERA/DAMAGEPLANguitarist 'Dimebag' Darrell Abbott, who was killed on stage by a crazed 'fan' in December 2004.] It's all fun and games until people get murdered, die and get arrested." He added, "Randy didn't cause that fan's death. That fan chose his path. People need to take responsibility for their actions no matter what the consequence. Of course it's sad that this person died, it's a tragedy, but it's not Randy's fault. I wouldn't have expected this to happen in Europe. The repercussions from this are going to make shows even more stringent than they already are."
FROM GWAR (ODERUS URENGUS):
"[I am] waiting anxiously to hear the fate of the human Randy. He is a honorary slave who has died for GWARmany times. [I am] alarmed by the lack of outrage in the entertainment community. If this was a pop artist, the media would be all over this. That's right — I am fucking appalled at the LACK of concern in the U.S. media for the fate of Randy Blythe… Naw, just because Randy is in a nasty metal band, you can just throw his ass in jail anytime you want. The whole of music media should come the fuck out and condemn this arrest and detainment. This whole thing stinks of a shakedown. And for all youBlythe haters, eat a bowl of dick. Randy is one of the coolest mofos on the planet. Don't be hating, that's my job. Where are the leaders of the American metal community voicing outrage about the idiotic arrest of one of our own… SHAME on you, rock star!"
FROM A BLABBERMOUTH.NET POSTER mikasedlinen (EXELLENT AND REASONABLE POST):
FROM BLABBERMOUTH.NET POSTER RICHARD TUCKER (GOOD POST BTW):
I don't think the problem is that the kid got shoved, its that he got shoved off the fucking stage. There's typically a barrier between the stage and the crowd, ya know. I dunno how it happened but I picture the kid falling between that gap and busting his head on the gate or ground. Either way would fucking suck.
I'd take an elbow to the face over that any day.
FROM BLABBERMOUTH.NET POSTER SAMADAMS:
_________________________________________________________________________________
The old LAMOUR (Brooklyn, NY) closed back in 1994 (and re-opened and closed for good after many mutations in 2009) in part due to the death of someone whom was shoved off stage via venue security:
http://www.nytimes.com/1996/05/09/nyregion/hard-core-threat-to-health-moshing-at-rock-concerts.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm
However, seeing SLAYER at the old LAMOUR was awesome \m/ \m/
Often alot of these concert tragedies don't involve moshing at all:
THE WHO's 1979 Cincinnati, Ohio tragedy:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1979_The_Who_concert_disaster
CUNY (CITY COLLEGE RAPPER/BASKETBALL GAME TRAGEDY)--BTW, ITP's author ended up taking 6 credits there, after the tragedy ( an event I had no interest in, and did NOT attend) and transfered the credits back to my primary college at SUNY NEW PALTZ. While getting a routine and mandatory MMR, I noticed how small and narow the gymnasium hall way was as the Health Center was in same building, creepy. However, CUNY= good college.
http://www.lipstickalley.com/f15/p-diddy-how-many-bodies-287789/index15.html
..Or this tragedy during LIMP BIZCUT's set during AUSTRALIA's 2001 BIG DAY OUT, every year a moment is observed for Jessica.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jessica_Michalik
..And this 2000 tragedy during PEARL JAM's set at ROSKILDE as a few fans were suffocated between crowd surges and crowdsurfers falling into holes:
I'm not judging what happened to the stagediver during that 5/2010 LAMB OF GOD show in the CZECK REPUBLIC and the awful tragic consequences, we don't know all the details.
UPDATE: 2AM EST: USA:
Upon review of the video of the 5/24/2010 LAMB OF GOD show in Prague, CZ there might be enough evidence to investigate RANDY BLYTHE and either his band or/and venue security in "Daniel's" death,
close enough to call regarding Randy Blythe. The question is: Did Randy shove the fan off stage and a fan lost his balance resulting in his death and or/and was the fan kicked in the head via LOG or/and venue/band security. Or did the fan, ("Daniel") under pressure dive into the pit on his own volition? This video proves enough evidence to detain Randy Blythe, this is tragic. If you've been living under a rock, LAMB OF GOD's vocalist Randy Blythe was charged with manslaughter in regards to an incident with a stage diving fan who dived after being tossed from the stage, and spent three days locked up in Prague, CZ until he posted bail yesterday ($400, 000).
This incident is similiar to the Lamour, Brooklyn NY, NYC (1994) incident where a bouncer shoved a stagediver off the stage to his death resulting in criminal charges against the bouncer.
We all KNOW the RISK regarding moshing, stage diving and crowd surfing and need to respect that boundary between the audience and band, and if clearly defined so be it, and the audience deserves that respect (as humans first) from the both the promoters, bouncers other fans and bands.
Being 42, ya get to feeling your age, it's rare that I would stage dive anymore, but I have during the last 30 years, only when INVITED, and I had some awesome, hillarious experiences of crowd surfing and stage diving, and never once, lucky me, I was NEVER dropped stage diving, and often I got pulled up, often landing, at worst on my feet, at best on my back, into pit packed like sardines. However, I am tickilish, so don't do that. I hope there is a "resolution" in the crisis as we're hoping for the the best for Randy Blythe and the LAMB OF GOD camp, and RIP to the young CZECK stage diver.
If you don't understand suffocating at a show, that almost happened to me at WOODSTOCK 94, untill I got "a little help from my freinds" as I crowdsurfed to a medical tent over the barricade, making me one of the first, unintentional of crowdsurfers at WOODSTOCK '94. The crowd surge during B-REALS's (CYPRESS HILL) crowdsurf at WOODSTOCK 94 was intense, I moved backwards as crowd surges will be the next ART OF DANCE entry.
If you see bouncers in between the band and audience (behind the stage), DON'T STAGE DIVE, or if you're crowd surfing, KNOW you will be pushed back into the pit before you climb onstage, and don't climb onstage unless invited. If the band invites ya, (indie, intimate hardcore show, club metal show), make it quick, don't step on peddles and don't destroy gear, know where to dive, into that packed pit, and those in front of the stage look out for divers and catch them. MOSH PIT ETIQUETTE 101. Great experiences, at the CHANCE, (Poughkeepsie, NY) and NYC clubs. Even Madison Square Garden, NYC, NY bouncers were always cool to crowd surfers.
Again, I've been thinking about the DIMEBAG (DARRELL ABBOTT-PANTERA/DAMAGEPLAN) tragedy and it depresses me to no end, just lay back, "get your pull", have a blacktooth, as we all know, DIMEBAG's death could have been prevented, as random as that gun toting wingnut (NATHAN GALE) was, we all are vulnerable on stage and in a mosh pit as well.
Also, consistent security, with training dealing with mosh pits and V security at festivals is key, if ya don't want stage divers, put it in your rider, no stage diving and tight security with a barricade. Better safe than sorry. If a band doesn't like stage divers, stop the show, and say so, call out the "hick in the pit". Walk off stage worst case scenario.
FANS: don't wear spikes, take off or/and tuck in your chain wallets, and don't bring weapons to shows. Don't stage dive unless invited. if you don't have experience in "Wall Of Death" or full floor pits, don't mosh. Avoid excessive drinking and drugs if you're going to shows and if you're planning on moshing. Don't crowd surf or stage dive if over 170 lbs, again don't stage dive unless invited. Beware of the front of the stage, everyone wants to be close to the band, if there's a crowd surge, you can be CRUSHED in between the barricade and fans behind you. THE WALL OF DEATH is less dangerous from far behind the inner aspect of the wall, you won't get run over if you're the last at the start of go from as far behind the wall as possible..
If you black out from a hit in the head in a pit, leave the show, and go to the hospital or medical tent ASAP, you may have a concussion.
SECURITY and BANDS: Tackle unwanted stage divers and lead them off the stage, do NOT shove them off the stage as off balance they could get injured, push fans (not a hard but light push, or catch them when they get to the barricade) back when they crowd surf as that indeed is the momentum of crowd surfers without always the intent to stage dive. TO PREVENT STAGE DIVERS: Situate security between the audience and stage with perhaps a barricade.
Mandatory barricades every 100 yards at music festivals to allievate crowd surges and to keep an eye on moshers.
Understand mosh pit culture. Side stage doors should be guarded perhaps by armed personel.
This SURVEY is interesting as I was going to save this for THE ART OF DANCE, and here we are: Two days ago, RANDY BLYTHE (LAMB OF GOD) was charged with manslaughter in connection with a stagediving fan during a 5/2010 show in the CZECK REPUBLIC.
At first, I laughed at the survey, a "criminology survey" as if moshers or musicians were criminals, as I still feel resentment towards the bias of the survey and in turn, kind of WANTED to be surveyed seeing all of this from both sides.
All musicians in punk, hardcore, metal core bands have also been in that pit and have taken the bruises that come with mosh pit culture.
All the best to RANDY BLYTHE of LAMB OF GOD and RIP to the young CZECK stage diver.
Moshing, crowd surfing and stagediving is an integral part of punk, alternative, hardcore, metal core and METAL culture and the trend will not go away, as the music moves us, so does our adrenaline.
We are "Lifers", and this is our music, and we are family, we have to look out for each other both fans, venues, promoters and bands.
With all hands, we must pick each other up and catch each others fall. Club security must be accessible, available and humanize the fans, as they are the boundary between the fans, and the bands.
This thing called moshing, crowd surfing and stagediving, you do at your own risk.
Chances are, the bands may come to YOU, for a little swim and jump in the pit for a little dive and surf.
SURVEY (FROM AN AUSTRALIAN MUSIC FAN/GRAD STUDENT):
With all hands, we must pick each other up and catch each others fall. Club security must be accessible, available and humanize the fans, as they are the boundary between the fans, and the bands.
This thing called moshing, crowd surfing and stagediving, you do at your own risk.
Chances are, the bands may come to YOU, for a little swim and jump in the pit for a little dive and surf.
SURVEY (FROM AN AUSTRALIAN MUSIC FAN/GRAD STUDENT):
Are you a fan of circle pits, walls of death and moshing:
I am seeking research subjects for a study of violence at concerts. The study will focus on your understanding is of the nature and meaning of circle pits, walls of death, moshing, etc.
Any individual aged 18-25 who regularly attends metal or hardcore concerts is invited to participate in this study.
Individuals who participate will receive either a $25 iTunes or Ticketek gift voucher. If you participate, you are also entitled to a summary of the study’s findings.
You would be required to attend the University of NSW at Kensington for one (1) hour and participate in an interview related to your experiences at concerts. This study will take place in June-July 2012.
To express your interest in being involved in this study, please contact Chief Investigator Kristyn Glanville at kristyn.glanville@student.
This research has University of New South Wales Ethics Approval No 12 033.
I am seeking research subjects for a study of violence at concerts. The study will focus on your understanding is of the nature and meaning of circle pits, walls of death, moshing, etc.
Any individual aged 18-25 who regularly attends metal or hardcore concerts is invited to participate in this study.
Individuals who participate will receive either a $25 iTunes or Ticketek gift voucher. If you participate, you are also entitled to a summary of the study’s findings.
You would be required to attend the University of NSW at Kensington for one (1) hour and participate in an interview related to your experiences at concerts. This study will take place in June-July 2012.
To express your interest in being involved in this study, please contact Chief Investigator Kristyn Glanville at kristyn.glanville@student.
This research has University of New South Wales Ethics Approval No 12 033.
University of New South Wales, Kensington, NSW 2052
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Thanks-Stay Metal, Stay Brutal-\m/ -l-
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